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BY DAVID SERVER |
Hey CDers! David 'Typhon24' Server here, with a bit of
a different article than what you may be used to from me. While my expertise
lies with all things comic book in origin, being the ever-learning film
student I am, I never turn down an opportunity from CountingDown to pick
the brain of a great filmmaker. So when the opportunity to chat with
Ron Howard about his upcoming dramatic suspense
thriller 'The Missing' arose, I jumped on it like the Grinch on Christmas.
When I arrived at the 'editing facility' in Connecticut,
I was certain I had reached the wrong address. When I hear 'editing
facility', I think of big, cold, impersonal concrete booths,
surrounded by miles of unpopulated parking lots and office buildings
as far as the eye can see. What lay before me, however, looked more
like something out of The Andy Griffith Show. The warm looking, vine-covered,
sunny brick house in front of me couldn't possibly be an office,
let alone an editing bay. But, this matched the address I had, so I
trod up the cobbled brick walkway and rang the bell. A woman answered
the door. "Hi, I'm David Server," I announced, hoping
she would know who I was, why I was there, etc. "Oh...who are
you here to see?" Damn. This was the wrong house, I knew it.
Damn damn damn. But, I figured I might as well double check. "Ron
Howard...?" I more inquired than affirmed. "Oh! You're
from the website! Come right in, Mr. Howard will be with you in a few
minutes." Wheeeew! It was all smooth sailing from there. I was
led into a cozy room with a big wood table covered in snacks (I respectfully
declined a cookie on account of my nervous stomach), next to a big
screen TV (presumably for watching dailies). After a brief wait, I
was joined by the one and only, very jovial, Academy Award winning
director, Ron Howard, and his two editors, Mike Hill and Dan Hanley.
After a brief introductory chat, we began the interview.
CountingDown: Could you talk a bit about The Missing's
storyline?
Ron Howard: One of the things that attracted me to the story is that
it works on a couple of levels, and I think that both are legitimately
involving and they were compelling to me. One is a very suspenseful rescue
story set in 1886 in Apache territory, and the story I think deals authentically
with elements of the culture clash of that time, and real fears versus
unfounded kind of paranoid fears, and a kind of hysteria that people
feel in periods of that kind of cultural conflict. So that was kind of
interesting that that was going on in that period because we feel that
today on a broader level. So I connected with that. It's also got
unusually strong women characters, especially for a period frontier movie
like that, where the women tend to, and I'm far from encyclopedic
in my knowledge of films, but my sense is that women are generally, even
though they can be colorful powerful characters, they're generally
symbolic of a single idea; they represent civilization or they represent
frontier moral decay. And it goes on and on that way. And I thought the
women in this story, played by Cate Blanchett, Evan Rachael Wood, and
Jenna Boyd, they were very relatable to me. I have three daughters and
a wife I've been married to for 28 years, who's a really
smart strong modern contemporary woman, and I related to the dynamics
that were being presented. So it was the struggle of those relationships
that seemed interesting to me.
CD: Were there any challenges in adapting this particular novel
for film?
RH: Well [screenwriter] Ken Kaufman made a lot of those choices early on, and
the first thing I read was not the book but Ken Kaufman's spec script,
and I thought that was really interesting. I worked with Ken on a few drafts,
and Akiva Goldsman came in and did some character work and some scene work.
Then we went back to the book, and there were a few ideas, particularly sort
of spiritual ideas, kind of underlining this culture clash, in the novel that
I really wanted to work into the movie. Otherwise, Ken had done a nice job
of taking the novel and turning it into a really compelling movie.
CD: Did you have any communication with Thomas Eidson (the author
of the novel) about your plans for the film? Did he have any input?
RH: Oh yeah, he read some drafts, and he came by and visited the set,
and he was very complimentary. He didn't feel like a freight train
had run over him or his book, which made me feel good. [laughs] Because
it's different in a lot of ways.
CD: This is your first time working with both of your leads,
Cate Blanchett and Tommy Lee Jones -- what convinced you that these
two were the right actors for their parts?
RH: Well, it's a really relatable adult father-daughter story,
and it's a story, we could be setting this in any era, any place,
and it would ring true. And so a lot of the story has to do with misunderstandings
of intention, mistakes that can't be rectified, but that nagging
question of, well, once that's recognized, where do you go from
there, in any kind of relationship. So, I think what I like about the
story is that the adventure stuff, the suspense element, really pulls
these two characters together, and they have to cope with these things,
and work some of these things through, but I'm also really happy
in that it doesn't offer any real answers or solutions really,
it just flushes out the ideas. Tommy Lee Jones is a terrific actor, and
when challenged, when given the opportunity, he's utterly authentic.
And he's also just an extremely intelligent and talented man. One
conversation with him and I knew he was right for the role, which I always
felt, but I also knew he would contribute that. And he loves this period...he
grew up in Texas, but on the place that he owned, he's got caves
where Cherokawa and Hikorea Apache bands lived for hundreds of years,
off and on. Those people were very nomadic. But he's got a cave
where they would grind grain and things like that, and there's
a hole that's like four or five feet deep from turning the stone
tool and grinding the grains, and spoke stains on the ceiling of the
cave and hieroglyphs and all that stuff. He just has a deep passion for
that period in history and also the subtleties of the politics of the
time and the social pressures of the time, and the combination of the
paradox of the idealism and the hope of building something and the reality
of the violence that was in the wake of all that. So he had a cool sense
of it. And Cate is just an absolute chameleon and she's just so
powerful, that I thought she would easily bring to the screen the kind
of strength that our character Maggie needs. And create the character,
and deliver the accent, and be of the time. And all the things that you
kind of take for granted when Cate Blanchett takes on a character.
CD: I read that you cast Simon Baker without even meeting him
-- what was it you saw in him that convinced you he was right for the
movie?
RH: Well, we have a lot of Apaches in the film, and some of them are
outstanding laudable individuals, and some of them are pretty dysfunctional
and out of control. And Jay Tavare plays a character named Kayitah who
turns out to have known Tommy Lee Jones (who plays a character named
Jones) who has lived 20 years with the Apaches. He's Anglo, but
he basically abandoned his family at one point, he just started roaming
with the Apaches and other tribes. So Jay has a son, and it's not
a huge role, but I wanted this character to grab our attention. There's
a couple of emotional moments, but I also wanted the two of them together
to be a striking contrast, not only to the other Apaches in the movie,
but also to the dysfunction in Jones' family, because the Apache
people were actually really family oriented, and they continue to be,
and incredibly loving, caring, nurturing parents, so I wanted to make
sure we demonstrated that. And so Simon has a good role, and he really
made the most of it. He's charismatic, and striking, and as soon
as I saw the video of him...I was having a hard time finding a kid to
play the part, and he has a kind of confidence and a presence that I
thought would make an impact with not that much screen time. He did a
really nice job. So does Jay.
CD: Any other cast members you'd like to mention?
RH: Evan Rachael Wood has a really good role in this movie, and I just
saw 'Thirteen', and I dunno if you've seen it yet,
but she's tremendous in it. 'Thirteen' is a leading
role, and this is a supporting role, but she's powerful in both,
and it's kind of amazing really, just her level of intensity and
emotional accessibility.
CD: I'm assuming Clint Howard once again has a role in
this one...?
RH: Haha, yeah, Clint's in this one, absolutely. Heh heh...[to
Mike Hill and Dan Hanley] How would you describe Clint in this?
Dan Hanley: An unsympathetic sheriff.
Mike Hill: It's a part that 20 years ago, 30 years ago, would
have been played by Sam Peckinpah or one of those guys, one of those
character actors.
RH: Yeah, that's a pretty good description. He plays a sheriff,
but he ain't Matt Dillon! [laughs].
CD: You're known to be a fan of the Western genre -- will
this be your first time directing a film from that genre?
RH: Yeah, I mean there were elements in 'Far and Away' that
were set in that time. And in the same way that I never felt *that* was,
even though sequences were 'western', I sort of don't
think of this as a genre exercise, y'know, 'Western as genre
exercise.' It's set in that time period, and even I would
tend to say 'I'm makin' a Western', but it's
a kind of shorthand that doesn't really appropriately demonstrate
the kind of story that we're telling. So the answer is, yeah, I've
always loved good Westerns, and I've always thought it's
a period of history that fascinates me and I'd love to make a film
set in that time, but whenever I would read a script, if it felt like
a sort of classic in genre terms, I couldn't bring myself to do
it, even though I've read some scripts, but I'm always looking
for one that would deal with the era in an authentic complicated way,
and yet still be a really compelling movie to watch, and be adventuresome.
It's of that time, but it's not shoot-outs...we don't
have fast-draw stuff, there's no cattle drive, there's no
range war, there's no jailbreaks. So instead it's really
a story of a family under incredible duress, a damaged group of people,
challenged by their time, and we can tell this story set in almost any
era, but I just thought this was a period in history I've always
wanted to work in.
CD: Are you guys happy with all the footage you're cutting
together?
Mike Hill: We were happy from the first day of shooting. It looked great,
and the performances have been excellent.
Dan Hanley: You couldn't ask for more.
Mike Hill: Every day was fun when we were on location, just cutting
the scenes together.
RH: We felt that way about shooting it. Salvatore Totino, our Director
of Photography, he did 'Any Given Sunday' and 'Changing
Lanes', and he's also been a top commercial DP for a long
time, and I thoroughly enjoyed working with these actors, telling this
story in that setting. It's just been fascinating right down the
line. And of course we're about five weeks into the cut, we're
like six or seven weeks into the sound mix, so we're kinda half
way through the cutting period. But I'd say we're ahead of
schedule in terms of really getting into shape. So there's still
a little head-scratching going on, but appropriately so.
CD: So Mike and Dan, were you guys on set at all during the
shoot?
DH: We were on location...
MH: We were in this little studio in Santa Fe called Garson Studios,
which is part of the College of Santa Fe...
RH: Yeah, Greer Garson left a lot of money to this college to give a
boost to their film department. So they built these sound stages, and
they're called the Greer Garson Soundstages. And they're
really great!
MH: We had a double wide trailer that we set up our AVID in, and it
was nice. Ron was always off shooting...we didn't see Ron that
much! Maybe on a few Saturdays, night shooting. Sometimes he was a couple
hours away. A lot of times.
RH: Yeah, we were usually a long way from Santa Fe. In fact, even to
see dailies, we set up this flat computer screen and just ran 'em
off of DVDs. A 21" flatscreen Mac, in a suburban, bunji-chorded
in! [laughs] Salvatore Totino and I would be kind bouncing along for
long rides!
MH: But I couldn't believe when you showed it to us, it was so
great!
RH: No, it was great, a real break-through.
MH: Those Apple screens are really incredible, the resolution is great.
CD: Do you guys enjoy this phase of the editing process?
DH: I love this part of the process because now it's totally collaborative,
where when you're trying to put it together, it's collaborative
but you're also trying to figure out how to put the pieces of the
puzzle together. Y'know, now it's just like, chunk, chunk...
MH: My favorite time is that time, the isolated period. I like the beginning
when you're first putting together more than this. Now this gets
painful! :::laughs::: You've gotta lose things you always liked,
and make harder decisions...
RH: ...You've gotta think more about the audience now...
MH: That's why I like it! Because you throw whatever perspective
you had earlier...well, not totally away...but now you've gotta
go, 'well, that was a great sequence, but...this scene in the movie
is long..."
RH: The thing that's interesting about it to me is that you devise
a film and there are a lot of minds involved, and a lot of interpretations,
but ultimately it kinda comes down to what you manage to shoot, cut together,
and you think you're communicating in a certain way, certain ideas.
And that's what it means to you, that's your interpretation...or
Dan's, or Mike's...and you start screening it, and it never
fails to amaze me where the communication actually deviates from what
your expectation was. In a weird way, it's almost like a game of
telephone where you send a message down the line, and it comes back and
you can't believe how mangled it is. Well, it's the same
kind of thing -- in your mind, you worked with the actors, you think
you know what a certain look/inflection/response means! And what it ought
to communicate. And then part of what this process is all about is understanding
what the story actually *does* communicate, and are you happy with what
it's communicating? Are you satisfied with that? Or not? So, while
sure, a lot of it is just tempo, rhythm, how are people responding, is
it as effective as it's supposed to be, it's also these other
surprises that pop up, and it's fascinating but it can be pretty
frustrating, because like what I said to somebody the other day, it just
boils down to this: I just wish I was right all the time! :::laughs:::
I don't like discovering that I didn't communicate exactly
what I thought I was communicating.
CD: Ron, you have a history of working with Mike and Dan as
editors for years now -- could you talk a little bit about the significance
and result of a good relationship between a director and editors?
RH: Well, you guys should answer this too, but...well, George Lucas
always said that the editing room is actually where you make the movie.
Everything else is gathering raw materials. So this relationship, this
creative relationship, is as crucial as any in the film. Dan and Mike
and myself contributing, we can't make something and totally turn
it on its ear scene after scene after scene, but it's amazing,
you can go a long way towards discovering what the movie really has to
offer. And then presenting that, given the raw materials, which is the
stuff that the director managed to shoot. So it's really crucial,
and also, as Dan was saying, he doesn't like being isolated, and
Mike was saying he does like that. As we work more over the years together,
increasingly, I have tried to shut up more and more and more during the
shooting period. I used to be really diligent about wanting to see every
bit of dailies with them, or send detailed notes when I couldn't
be there. And sort of by accident, I've learned times when I just
really couldn't do that, and I'd seen the scene as cut together,
I've learned that there's really great value in my putting
my best foot forward, and then Dan or Mike or whoever takes a scene and
cuts it, and interprets it. And often right off the bat, it's slightly
different than what I would have maybe laid down on paper as a schematic
for the scene. But it's noticing something else, some other virtue
that the scene has, and it's strong. So the collaboration I think
just keeps getting better and better.
MH: Well, what's nice is, having worked together for 21 years,
we don't have to worry about stepping on each other's egos,
or we just know each other so well that we don't have to...when
you're an editor and you work for a director the first time, there's
a whole thing besides the work, you want to make sure that you communicate,
and there's always nervousness and all that. But not with this,
because we've just been at it so long. So we don't have to
worry about that kind of stuff; it's just the work, and the decisions
and all that, it just comes much more easily now.
RH: I'm convinced that with digital editing, that the process
that these guys have to go through is so much more weighted towards the
creative now than it ever was, whereas before there was a part of it
that was kind of time management...In just getting through and keeping
track of the volume of the footage. And it influenced decision making,
and now, the first time I saw these guys working on an AVID, when they
made the jump from film to the AVID, I thought, wow, this is suddenly
like watching a contemporary artist, like a printmaker, working in a
studio. Layers after layers, and trying this and trying that, until they'd
come up with the presentation that they want to make. And it's
a lot more experimental. And I thought that was kind of a breakthrough,
that Dan and Mike were both really taking advantage of.
MH: Oh yeah, it's great...it's like a dream, because before
so much of your time was spent just figuring out the logistics of handling
all the film, rolls, loading and unloading...
DH: ...You had to break it down into pieces, make sure you had the right
pieces or you would have to load the whole camera again...
MH: You didn't have the freedom to experiment like you do now...you
just couldn't. It was daunting.
RH: The one thing that I've also noticed, more and more, is that
because of all the other channels on the AVID, there's a lot more
experimentation in every facet of post-production going on concurrently,
so even though they're not final sound effects, there are ideas
being experimented with, and choices being zeroed in on, in sound effects,
visual effects...even sometimes the temp music that you chose, that is
really exciting because it used to be that that stuff was almost entirely
left for a sort of a four week period after you locked and before you
mixed [the sound]. Now you get to finesse it and work it and you can
always kind of say, well I know this is a temp mix, and this is not the
sound effect, and this is not the visual effect, but this works, so we
just need to get something like this.
DH: I've heard shows where's they've gone out like
16 tracks, we're kind of trying to keep it to 8, but it definitely
helps because playing with sound, you start to get ideas for what's
working, or that's too loud, the music's too loud...Like
with the visual effects on this one? The guys upstairs are using Adobe
Premiere or something...they came up with one effect where they had one
of the guys who's a good artist just draw people, but they were
just black kinda cartoons. And then they used the 3D thing, and it's...it
gets a reaction in the movie!
MH: They're falling off a cliff...
RH: But the first time we screened it with an audience, they went, [jumps
forward out of his seat] "WOAH!!!" [laughs] It's not
that they're using horrible equipment, but these guys are using
stick figures with a little 3D motion, they recorded a little voice,
and suddenly we have a complete effect in there! [laughs]
CD: What comes next in post-production for this film before
its ready for theaters?
DH: We'll spot with the composer next week, James Horner will
come in, which should be pretty interesting because the temp score we
have is...ok...it's pretty good. But it's a lot of different
pieces, and some are just...it doesn't really track...
MH: Not that much Horner in there, either...
DH: Not much, no...And it's kind of an interesting movie to score
I think, just because of the fact that things aren't really resolved
totally, so it's kind of like it's dysfunctional, so you
can't go with sweeping...
RH: Yeah, James has his work cut out for him, because the movie, in
trying to grow up and become a really cohesive compelling suspense drama,
the emotional themes have to connect, and the suspense has to be there,
and the excitement and sort of the sense of adventure and scope needs
to be there...so it's really challenging, and you can't just
go and temp score it. Because it all depends on these certain turns and
shifts and things that have to be very very specific to this movie. But
Mike's right, it's gonna be a very original kind of score
for James. I think 'Braveheart' was really a breakthrough
score for him, because it was really a story, a tone, that he hadn't
ever dealt with in a film before.
MH: I thought he had some really interesting cues in 'A Beautiful
Mind', too...
RH: Yeah, he did, which is a whole other kind of thing, which is the
dark complexity of that guy's mind, sort of his psyche, something
that James responded to. The thing that I love about James the most is
that he's a really good storyteller. He's a tremendous musician,
but more than anything, he loves to understand and tell the story...it's
like having another great actor involved. He takes a lot of clues from
the actors, and in this film, with these performances, Tommy Lee and
Cate, these are pretty good performances, and Evan is awesome, and Eric
Schweig, who plays our villain, is really interesting. And Jenna is unbelievable.
So he's got I think some of the stronger dramatic performances
that I've been associated with; he's got a lot to key off
of.
MH: I would say Cate is one of the best actresses we've ever had,
of all the movies we've done.
DH: Yeah, she is so natural.
MH: And, of course, I've always loved Tommy Lee, so I was thrilled
he was gonna be in it. But all the takes are good, but yeah, it's
been really fun in that regard.
DH: And they both feel so natural in the parts, y'know how sometimes
performances are off, they're not part of it, you're not
sunk into the movie and you're sort of just watching the performances?
These are just so natural.
MH: And Tommy's speaking a lot of Apache in the film, a lot of
it subtitled, not all of it. But he does it so naturally, you wouldn't
even question it at all.
DH: Yeah, it's like he speaks Apache. The performance is there
with it, there's no hesitation with the line delivery, or halting...
MH: But apparently he was reading off cue-cards, a lot of it. But you
really don't know, it's so natural sounding. A lot of times
when actors do Indian language, it sounds like they're reciting.
DH: But with Tommy, it's unbelievable to watch that. Just the
idea...you think the accent's easy? You try to walk and chew gum
and hit a mark? Cause he's hitting the mark and delivering a language.
But back to James Horner, James is really pretty open to any suggestions.
Always wants input. He's very inquisitive -- how we feel, why we
picked a certain temp track, what we like, what do we like about it.
CD: On kind of a side note, what was it like winning the Oscar?
[laughs all around]
DH: Coooooool!
RH: It was thrilling to be sure, and as I was walking up, weirdly, as
I was walking up the steps, I suddenly, having been an actor, I had this
strange sensation that I was an actor in a scene playing a guy who'd
just won the Academy Award. Because I saw the camera crane swinging around,
y'know the one that covers everything, the TV show. And I saw that,
and it's almost like I'm just playing this part of this guy,
and this was the first take, and there were probably gonna be other takes
[laughs], which there weren't! But I thought I was pretty cool
during the whole event, and when the two awards came and went, director
and picture, and when I'm sitting backstage with [Producer Brian
Grazer], I never have stomach problems, I had the most unbelievable abdominal
pain you could possibly imagine. And I realize that I must have just
had four hours of absolute tension, just clenching. But it was amazing,
and I'm gonna come right out and say this, I never thought that
winning an Academy Award was gonna change anything, because at the point
in my life where I was going to be a candidate, I was already achieving
all my dreams, and I was working with the people I wanted to work with,
telling the stories I wanted to tell...And I fully recognize all the
flaws in turning an artistic endeavor like filmmaking into a competition,
and I get all of it. It's a fun Hollywood tradition, I understand.
But, as the time has gone by, I have to say that it just pleases me more
and more and more each passing month that I'm actually on the list!
So, it's been really really gratifying. I'm really pleased
to say that I was able to somehow liberate myself from feeling that whatever
I did, and maybe that's also because it came sort of mid-career
instead of early, that feeling that I had to worry about what I've
followed it up with. Because I've made a lot of films, some of
them have been really well received, others have been less so, I understand
the elevator ride of mainstream high-profile filmmaking, so I haven't
really felt that pressure about 'The Missing' or the upcoming 'Cinderella
Man'. I've always wanted to make the best movie I could,
each and every time, and nothing's had to change.
MH: We were glad to welcome him to the club...[laughs]
RH: They came first! Bastards! [laughs]
MH: Took you about six years, though!
RH: Yeah, it took me a long time to catch up!
DH: But you've got two, now! You've topped our one! [laughs]
CD: And finally, what projects do you have coming up next after
this film? I know earlier you mentioned 'Cinderella Man'...
RH: Russell Crowe, Renee Zellweger, and it's based on a true story
about a remarkable guy named Jim Braddock, who in a one year period of
time went from breadlines and very sporadic stevedore work to winning
the heavyweight championship, beating Max Baer. And it's a kind
of amazing depression era story as much about the shocking ramifications
of sudden poverty as it is about boxing. But again, I like that it follows
two parallel levels.
CD: Mike and Dan, are you planning to join Ron again for the next one?
MH: If he'll hire us, yeah. [laughs]
RH: We've got a screening next week, let's see how *that*
goes. [laughs] Brian's producing, Akiva Goldsman's coming
in and doing a rewrite on it. And Todd Hallowell's gonna be on
it as an Executive Producer and Second Unit Director if there is a second
unit, and Salvatore Totini is gonna shoot it.
CD: Ok, that wraps stuff up for me -- thanks so much for your
time guys!
And with that, the interview was over. I was allowed a brief peek
up at the editing booth before I departed, and saw some stills and
layouts of scenes featuring Tommy Lee Jones and Cate Blanchett. After
two quick photos, I let them get back to work and thanked them again
for their time. It was a great experience, and the movie seems like
it could be really interesting, so give it a look when it hits theaters!
That's all for now from me! Until next time...
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